games™ Forum

NEEMAN wrote:Sorry, but I thought the whole point of a legally enforcable ratings systems was so that children cannot play violent games?

If it's rated 18, then it is legally only suitable for adults. By banning this, they are saying it is unsuitable for adults. In a world where Kill Bill vol. 1 can get a cinema release, this seems out of order.

toneeblair wrote:

NEEMAN wrote:Look, if it's not political, then the BBFC is going to have to explain what is worse about this game than the first one. After all, it didn't ban Manhunt, did it?

Does anyone here really think there is anything substantially different between this game and the last?

in their press release they've stated it was the context of the violence.

without justification (and the first game had an effective narrative similar to some novels and movies of the 80s and 90s) they have to be tougher on the content.

none of us have played the sequel, so i don't think it's right we base arguments on conjecture.

Sasquatch wrote:

NEEMAN wrote:Sorry, but I thought the whole point of a legally enforcable ratings systems was so that children cannot play violent games?

If it's rated 18, then it is legally only suitable for adults. By banning this, they are saying it is unsuitable for adults. In a world where Kill Bill vol. 1 can get a cinema release, this seems out of order.

How can you enforce that? A kid asks their parent to buy game X because "it's really really good" or "everyone else has it" or "I'll never speak to you again, I hate you!" or all the above.

Anyway, my point - do you make sure the parent is buying it for themselves? No; even if you asked, they could lie

Do you try and educate them as to the nature of such games their children may play? No - it'd cost too much on a large scale (maybe national) level

Sasquatch wrote:I know, but games are in question here. At least, that's what I thought

FatTrucker wrote:TBH I think the argument about children getting their hands on it is an irrelevant one in terms of why this game was knocked back. The same argument applies to any other game featuring adult content and yet hasn't been a factor in classification.

Its worth considering a different perspective on it though. The game was clearly designed to court controversy and achieve sales on the back of entirely predictable media hysteria. Its already been established that the games lack of context was the issue rather than its actual content. It is in effect a game where the entirety of its premise is to commit murder for its own sake and to experiment with ways to expedite it....for no apparent reason beyond enjoyment of the gratuity of the violence. A bit like the film Hostel being released with all the scenes except for the ones in the torture rooms removed, removing any context and promoting itself purely on enjoyment of the sickening acts portrayed in it.

In an arena where gamers are constantly spitting feathers because games aren't taken seriously in mainstream circles and wanting games to feature more mature and advanced content, is there really still a place for this kind of sensationalist, lowest common denominator, cynical brand of games development?.

It certainly does nothing to promote games as the viable adult medium that we all want them to be, so really gamers should be more f**ked off at people that peddle these titles and help to keep the industry firmly in its immature pigeonhole than at the BBFC who knocked it back because they recognised it for exactly what it was.

NEEMAN wrote:
But how come you can 'peddle' far worse in cinemas without knocking the entire medium? More double standards, it would seem.

FatTrucker wrote:

NEEMAN wrote:
But how come you can 'peddle' far worse in cinemas without knocking the entire medium? More double standards, it would seem.

But they don't. When was the last time you watched any form of media that was purely about murder and its depiction?.
Even gratuitous films like Hostel have some kind of context, plot and storyline. They have other elements that to some extent justify the depictions of violence.

Manhunt 2 doesn't do any of that its just about the violence....thats it!. And thats why it was knocked back. It does nothing to justify its content past the enjoyment of the depictions of violence itself. There is no other aim than to do murder in as many ways as possible for no apparent reason at all. Its pure violent porn.

sasquatch wrote:Yes, but in films you can't pretend you're going to garrotte(sp) someone - you can in a game. That pretence is given more power with the use of the Wiimote - which also covers little Jimmy getting his grubby mitts on it

And I'm not saying he's going to run out and throttle next door's cat or something - but you do have to wonder at the possible effects of that

Couple that development with heightened graphical realism (should the other consoles follow the Wii's control innovation somehow), not to mention any prospective progress in AI and, well, who knows

NEEMAN wrote:

FatTrucker wrote:

NEEMAN wrote:
But how come you can 'peddle' far worse in cinemas without knocking the entire medium? More double standards, it would seem.

But they don't. When was the last time you watched any form of media that was purely about murder and its depiction?.
Even gratuitous films like Hostel have some kind of context, plot and storyline. They have other elements that to some extent justify the depictions of violence.

Manhunt 2 doesn't do any of that its just about the violence....thats it!. And thats why it was knocked back. It does nothing to justify its content past the enjoyment of the depictions of violence itself. There is no other aim than to do murder in as many ways as possible for no apparent reason at all. Its pure violent porn.

To the best of my knowledge, all previews of the game so far have included mention of some sort of story- escape from prison etc.

sasquatch wrote:Yes, but in films you can't pretend you're going to garrotte(sp) someone - you can in a game. That pretence is given more power with the use of the Wiimote - which also covers little Jimmy getting his grubby mitts on it

And I'm not saying he's going to run out and throttle next door's cat or something - but you do have to wonder at the possible effects of that

Couple that development with heightened graphical realism (should the other consoles follow the Wii's control innovation somehow), not to mention any prospective progress in AI and, well, who knows

Well then why do have the same ratings system as films? If you're going to use the same system, you have to treat them the same way- otherwise what's the point?