The M$ thread

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One-armed dwarf
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Re: The M$ thread

Post by One-armed dwarf » Thu Apr 06, 2017 8:41 pm

All the games will all be identical, the image will be cleaner and probably run smoother with more detail

Questions answered 8)
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Re: The M$ thread

Post by maf-me-quick » Thu Apr 06, 2017 8:56 pm

Then the only question left is why?
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Re: The M$ thread

Post by One-armed dwarf » Thu Apr 06, 2017 8:57 pm

Because it's not called the next Xbox, it's still an Xbox One.
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Re: The M$ thread

Post by maf-me-quick » Thu Apr 06, 2017 9:01 pm

No I mean why as in why bother at all.
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Re: The M$ thread

Post by maf-me-quick » Thu Apr 06, 2017 9:03 pm

Arguably the image cleaner run smoother more detail was the big difference between last gen and this one. A lot if these games seem pretty fucking similar.
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Re: The M$ thread

Post by One-armed dwarf » Thu Apr 06, 2017 9:10 pm

4K TVs are the reason
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Re: The M$ thread

Post by maf-me-quick » Thu Apr 06, 2017 9:25 pm

That only makes sense tangentially. Sony has an interest in 4K displays because they make them, Xbox then need to do that because Sony does it, but they don't get a real boom out of that. It's a keeping up with the Jensons thing.

I'm saying slide this in to next gen and let it be Xbox One backwards compatible.

Dwarf tell me this. Bar HD what is he big difference between PS2 to 360 and why did we not see that with 360 to PS4. Did the technology reach a point that it's all the same stuff but better looking or is the technology still not there to enable brand new game design?
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Re: The M$ thread

Post by Blakey » Thu Apr 06, 2017 10:18 pm

One-armed dwarf wrote:Raw power isn't everything. The dig foundry video makes the claim that the hardware is engineered around the needs of the already existing software, so Forza sounds like a technical demonstration of that. (You might call this a massive argument in favour of these mid-gen power upgrades, no more of this 'power of the Cell' type nonsense where developers spend an entire generation trying to figure out what Mark Cerny was thinking)

On top of that the architecture of the Scorpio's CPU is very closely aligned with DX12 that drastically reduces the amount of calls needed to be made to get work done.

Again not a software engineer but for as little as I know PC development seems like it involves several more layers of abstraction (as in developers must work at a higher, more generalised level) to get a game working across a wide array of hardware configurations, from Intel iGPUs to the dedicated stuff that nVidia and AMD make. While console development is much more bare metal/low level type stuff which is why stuff like Uncharted and Horizon is possible. It's also why an equivalently powerful PC will often not run a game as good as a console even though it seems like it should.
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From what I've seen so far, there is some evidence that Scorpio's true 4K performance could pose a challenge to the likes of Nvidia's GTX 1070 and AMD's Fury X-class hardware. I've seen Microsoft's new console running a Forza Motorsport 6-level experience locked to 4K60 on the equivalent to PC's ultra settings - cranking up the quality presets to obscene levels was one of the first things developer Turn 10 did when confronted with the sheer amount of headroom it had left after a straight Xbox One port. Out of interest, we tested Forza 6 Apex with similar settings at 4K on GTX 1060, 1070 and 1080. Frames were dropped on GTX 1060 (and a lot of them when wet weather conditions kicked in), while GTX 1070 held firm with only the most intense wet weather conditions causing performance dips. Only GTX 1080 held completely solid in all test cases. It's only one data point, and the extent to which the code is comparable at all is debatable, but it certainly doesn't harm Scorpio's credentials: Forza 6 Apex received plenty of praise for the quality of its PC port.

Gee, guess I better count out that 1070 purchase then :o

Ah ok, cheers for the info, have to say I missed that paragraph from the original article.

I'm reluctant to fully believe much of these claims before E3 because of all the nonsense claims and tech that was either exaggerated or completely made up before the current-gen launch, but if it's truly as powerful as a GTX 1070 that's damn impressive.

The way I read the stats was like-for-like in terms of raw power but you're right if Microsoft are getting more out of the internals than a typical PC rig then I guess it could be more powerful than I thought.

Still think the Jaguar CPU will hold it back a little though, and the 2.3ghz clock speed isn't great, but I guess they probably did that to ensure original xbox one games can easily port to Scorpio and vice versa.
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Re: The M$ thread

Post by Maryokutai » Fri Apr 07, 2017 1:48 pm

maf-me-quick wrote:No I mean why as in why bother at all.
That's what my grumpyness was going for.

I can only imagine the amount of dollars blewn into this project. However I can safely say that I personally would have preferred them using that money to develop some decent games instead of building a new machine that blows up my existing library to 4K because, frankly, I couldn't care less about that. Scorpio and PS4 Pro Pro are pretty much the 1080p/900p discussions reloaded: endless tech-talk to divert people from realizing their are no new games coming. PS4 at least has some substantial support from indies and japanese developers but why on earth is Microsoft pushing hardware when there's no exclusive software to sell the machine?

They messed up the launch of Xbox One. That sucks, sure, but it's still doing okay. But you're not going to convince some hardcore PS-dude that he should stop playing Uncharted just because there's a new Xbox pushing out more pixels. You need to show him Decharted instead.

So yeah, for me it's just a huge waste of resources that's going to negatively impact the games library of Xbox in the future.

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Re: The M$ thread

Post by One-armed dwarf » Fri Apr 07, 2017 1:56 pm

The xbox guy (I can't remember his name) has admitted that a lot of this is about reclaiming the 'mind-share' of the development community back to the xbox ecosystem where they have lost a lot of ground against Sony. And naturally the xbox brand doesn't have a lot going for it in general, weaker hardware and less interesting software, so it all makes sense I think.

Just look at how ludicrously strong the Sony software library is becoming, it's almost approaching the PS2 years. Scorpio I think is partly about challenging this narrative.
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Re: The M$ thread

Post by One-armed dwarf » Tue Apr 11, 2017 1:27 pm

Xbox Scorpio will support AMD's FreeSync: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1359606

FreeSync and G-Sync (nVidia's tech) are technologies which mitigate framerate-related screen-judder and screen-tearing when a game runs into performance difficulties.

So basically if a game drops frames it basically won't really matter that much. If you have one of these screens that is.

It would be awesome if these standards started getting pick up in TVs also
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Re: The M$ thread

Post by sleepery jeem » Wed Apr 12, 2017 5:07 pm

Project Scorpio's Specs Are Great and All, But...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CBLmd-XVIXQ


Yea Yong passes judgment.
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Re: The M$ thread

Post by sleepery jeem » Fri Apr 14, 2017 4:50 pm

Microsoft Detail Their Supercharged Xbox Project Scorpio Dev Kit

Once a games console has been announced, all of its technical details bared to the world, the hushed talk about dev kits tends to die down. They’re essentially the same console hardware are is released to the public, but with different software that allows for development code to be run and with many more options and diagnostic tools available to developers. The dev kit for Project Scorpio is a little different, though, and it another example of how Microsoft are devoting themselves to winning back both developers and gamers.

For one thing, it’s actually even more powerful than the Scorpio itself. The CPU is clocked the same, at 2.3Ghz, but there’s 44 Compute Units in the GPU compared to 40 CUs in the consumer Scorpio, the RAM is doubled to 24GB, and it features a 1TB SSD as opposed to a spinning HDD.

It stems from a desire to get the best out of lower powered hardware, with Microsoft’s Kevin Gammill saying to Gamasutra that, “At a high level, it’s much easier for a game developer to come in higher and tune down, than come in lower and tune up. Or nail it. That just rarely happens. Our overarching design principle was to make it easy for devs to hit our goals: 4K, 4K textures, rocksteady framerates, HDR, wide color gamut, and spatial audio.”

To that end, the Scorpio dev kit can run in four distinct modes: full power, retail Scorpio, Xbox One S and Xbox One. If necessary, it can step down to match the clock speeds and number of enabled cores of the original Xbox One, as a quick and easy way for developers to check that unit. However, with changes to the CPU and GPU design and a move away from the twinned ESRAM and DDR3 RAM set up, it’s not an exact match.

Beyond that, there’s also an uncommonly customised fit and finish to these units. Once the final retail form of a console has been decided, that’s usually the form that dev kits adopt, so a dev kit PS4 just looks like a PS4, Switch looks like a Switch and so on. Not so with Scorpio dev kit, which has been designed with an OLED display on the front to show useful data like frames per second, CPU load and so on at a glance, there’s programmable buttons on the front, and an extra network interface for collecting debug information while playing multiplayer.

Last but not least, having found that developers were stacking consoles on top of each other to save space – replete with ungainly LEGO-based spacing solutions – Microsoft changed the cooling to vent hot air out the back and sides of the console as opposed to the top, as on the retail Xbox One and One S.
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Re: The M$ thread

Post by sleepery jeem » Wed May 24, 2017 5:14 pm

Xbox Game Pass Service Begins June 1, 2017



Back in March, Microsoft revealed it would be offering a service akin to PlayStation Now called Xbox Game Pass. For a monthly fee, people would be able to download and play over 100 games to their Xbox One. We now know the exact launch date, free trial length, and price across regions. Beginning June 1, 2017, people can pay $9.99/€9.99/£7.99 each month to participate in the program. Before they do, they can see if the service is something they would like with a 14-day free trial.



With the Xbox Game Pass, people are able to download all of the games in the subscription’s library and play them as much as they would like for free. There will supposedly be over 100 games at launch, with new titles being added all the time. After you download a game, you can play it as long as you are subscribed and it is part of the Xbox Game Pass library, and there’s no always online requirement. If you enjoy the game you are playing, you can buy it for 20% off and get 10% off of its DLC.



Some of the titles that will be available when the Xbox Game Pass launches include Halo 5, Mega Man Legacy Collection, Lego Batman, NBA 2K16, Payday 2: Crimewave Edition, Saints Row IV: Re-Elected, and Sega Vintage Collection: Streets of Rage.
The goal of our culture now is not the emancipation of the individual from the group, but the permanent definition of the individual by the group.
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Re: The M$ thread

Post by sleepery jeem » Sat Jun 03, 2017 5:07 pm

Came across some odd news on a promotion scheme MS is running just now.

Seems that you can get free MS points for using the bing search engine

https://www.theverge.com/2017/6/1/15723 ... k-features
The goal of our culture now is not the emancipation of the individual from the group, but the permanent definition of the individual by the group.
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